They extended apple's dev environment and then built an online iWork suite. They are likely going the 37 signals route until Apple offers them a check they can not refuse.

That's a great point. And this is something I've been thinking about recently.

It is as if some start-up business models are merely based on creating technology that either another company will want to buy outright because it runs parallel to their goals and portfolio - or because larger competition doesn't want to have to pay dearly for not buying them out while they could.

Acquisitions don't result in lasting innovation in my eyes - it increases proprietary code bases. Early exits are like leaving a cash poker game after your first big hand, the fun was just beginning.

I hope to see more and more "start-ups" use less and less VC funding (we do realize that it is the VCs who have the winning scenario here, RIGHT?), say "F U" to acquisitions, and stay around long enough to make a sustainable difference.

Actually I hope Apple take an enlightened approach to this, and see it as a valid migration/coexistence/hybrid strategy, rather than get heavy. Its the ultimate complement to them.

Well executed? Absolutely. Innovative? Well... not exactly.

Seek to 23:10 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j02b8Fuz73A

(Man, look at that hair!)

I don't mean to downplay 280north's work - I'm very impressed with what they're doing. It just bothers me when people see a derivative work and think it to be original. (Ahem, Chris Hughes)

That video is an indictment of Win32 more than anything else. WOW!

I imagine there's plenty of money to be made by developers who are creating more traditional business apps which run on an intranet - it's what i do :)

And you make a good point. Some will bite.

My pondering was merely a function of - is it enough to build a business?

For instance, if Google wanted to become your one-stop-shop for online desktop-grade web applications (aren't they kind of already? GWT?), developing a tool like this in house would be a fantastic idea as it would increase the productivity of the developers.

But that's Google. The exception not the rule.

How many desktop-rich web applications have "made it." Facebook, Google Applications, the newly exiting Mint come to mind. How many of you hackers here have created incredible technology with 3 hits a month and no paying customers?

I guess the point I'm trying to press here is how many tech companies can exist to feed the need of other tech companies (which presumably make money from other sources)?

Start ups like 37 Signals were smart as hell because they saw the demand for simple services (communication, version control, project management) from a large pool of willing customers ready to cut their costs (other tech start ups).

But where do THOSE start ups get their money? VCs? Acquisitions? (That money only counts if the founders reinvest it in the industry) This begs the question - are the large successes like Facebook/Google/Twitter/Mint/etc feeding a working-class of willing tech "entrepreneurs" for money that simply doesn't exist?

I encourage debate as this seems like a gaping hole in some Valley-Hacker mentalities.

Is it enough to build a business?

Well, considering they could probably charge $100-200 for such an IDE, and that there are now a very large (100K and growing) set of Cocoa developers (thanks to the iPhone, mostly) who can be immediately productive in such an environment, delivering apps on Web, Mac, and Windows, ...

'How many desktop-rich web applications have "made it."'

maybe that depends on your definition of 'made it'. Personally I think any self-sustaining business is a sign of success - and using this definition there are many thousands of successful software developers out there making a comfortable living building rich web apps that you'll never hear of simply because they don't fit into the social media zeitgeist

You make a fantastic point.

It's the social psychology principle at play - what stories can we think of that are easy to recall?

That said - does anyone know of a desktop-rich web app that is in the black from charging to use it (That isn't already very popular)?