> Right to work (i.e., having a valid EAD card) and immigration status are two different things
They're extremely intertwined and often practically the same thing. They become an "illegal migrant" for continuing to work to pay for groceries and rent while not having a lawful status allowing such activity. A deportable offense, correct?
> Their workloads increased significantly over the past 3-4 years due to various factors, unfortunately.
Good job showing your true colors. Issues like this have existed for decades. I know of people that struggled in this exact scenario in the 90s and 2000s, and I was only a child at the time. Maybe we should have passed that bipartisan immigration bill the orange man said no to which would have actually funded processing the workload. In the end though this administration doesn't want these people, they want to send them to prison camps. You can tell by watching what they do, raiding people showing up to their court proceedings, sending them to hellhole detention facilities without any due process, and ignoring court decisions.
> They're extremely intertwined and often practically the same thing.
Well, no? You can have a valid status but without right to work. For example, B1/2 or F-2 visas.
> They become an "illegal migrant" for continuing to work to pay for groceries and rent while not having a lawful status allowing such activity.
This is not true. Working without authorization is simply that: unauthorized employment. By itself it does not lead to become an illegal immigrant. However, it can jeopardize future changes in status, etc.
> Good job showing your true colors.
What?
> I know of people that struggled in this exact scenario in the 90s and 2000s, and I was only a child at the time.
Which are what?
> Maybe we should have passed that immigration bill the orange man said no to which would have actually funded processing the workload.
Biden could have done it during his term in 2020-22: he had both the senate and the house. Yet, he didn’t. It’s extremely naive to think that lack of reform is due to Trump. No party is interested in changing the status quo. Especially, if you consider how anti illegal immigration the Democratic Party was pre 2021 or so (enough to watch Bernie’s interviews pre 2020).
Working without authorization is being an illegal migrant being an "illegal immigrant". They're doing things here not allowed by any kind of visa or authorization they may or may not have. Kind of one of the problems with the term, you'll define it one way while others will define it another.
You're showing your true colors suggesting this issue happened during Biden's term, and now you're both sides-ing the issue. One side's solution was passing an immigration reform bill and hiring more judges and administration to handle the influx in applications. The others is to send people to CECOT and other prison camps with no due process (even those with legal status) and ignore the courts. They're not the same.
> Working without authorization is being an illegal migrant being an "illegal immigrant".
No. Illegal immigrant is someone who entered without inspection, or someone who overstayed their visa (e.g., B1 tourist admitted for 90 days, and who failed to leave the US). See here, for example, https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/illegal_immigrant
In contrast to that, the same individual on B1 visa admitted for 90 days who decided to work without authorization, and caught, will not be considered illegal immigrant, because they are in the country legally even though they violate some terms of their visa. Of course, when caught they probably will be deported, which again won't make them illegal immigrants.
I do not know why can accept that these are two different definitions. I personally know F-2 visa holders who had to not work between EADs. It did not make them illegal immigrants, because they had a valid status.
> You're showing your true colors suggesting this issue happened during Biden's term, and now you're both sides-ing the issue. One side's solution was passing an immigration reform bill and hiring more judges and administration to handle the influx in applications. The others is to send people to CECOT and other prison camps with no due process (even those with legal status) and ignore the courts. They're not the same.
I am sorry, but I do not plan to engage in emotions and hypotheticals as it is not constructive and leads nowhere.
Like, say, continuing to work the job even after their work visa expired?
> I personally know F-2 visa holders who had to not work between EADs. It did not make them illegal immigrants
I'm not talking about those people who lawfully stop working during that window, I'm talking about those who do not have that luxury to coast for 90+ some odd days. I do not know why you can't seem to understand it.
Actually, I do. Because you're the kind of person who acts like our immigration woes happened 3-4 years ago.
> will not be considered illegal immigrant
You're narrowly defining "illegal immigrant" as someone without any visa status. Most others would include violating the terms of their lawful admission, aka working when they're on a tourist visa. There isn't an official government definition to "illegal immigrant" under the law.
> engage in emotions and hypotheticals
These statements are not hypotheticals. They are detaining those with lawful status. They are sending people to CECOT without due process. They are ignoring court opinions. The Republican party did vote down a bipartisan bill in the end because Trump didn't want it. You appear to not engage with reality.
> Like, say, continuing to work the job even after their work visa expired?
Yes? I've literally wrote it in my comment.
> I'm not talking about those people who lawfully stop working during that window, I'm talking about those who do not have that luxury to coast for 90+ some odd days.
I do not understand what does it have to do with anything? Definitions are definitions, and reasons for violating the terms of the visa are reasons for violating the terms. Do you want to call anyone one who is not the citizen illegal immigrant? Be my guest.
> Because you're the kind of person who acts like our immigration woes happened 3-4 years ago.
I have no idea what are you talking about. If you can, please form a coherent argument.
> These statements are not hypotheticals. They are detaining those with lawful status. They are sending people to CECOT without due process. They are ignoring court opinions. The Republican party did vote down a bipartisan bill in the end because Trump didn't want it. You appear to not engage with reality.
What reality? How old are you?
I am old enough to remember that in the beginning of Obama's administration Democrats controlled both the senate and the House, as well as the presidency. Was it Trump that prevented them from fixing the immigration system?
This is hacker news, not reddit. Try to engage like an adult.
> Their workloads increased significantly over the past 3-4 years due to various factors, unfortunately.
Must be outside of your context window. You were clearly drawing in the idea this backlog of cases and immigration state we're in is the result largely from Biden's term. I see no other real reason to include such a statement. It's been true for decades.
> Do you want to call anyone one who is not the citizen illegal immigrant? Be my guest.
Not what I'm suggesting in the slightest. Reread my statements to find out more.
> What reality?
Denying obvious facts. Incredible. Please inform yourself to the reality of today before engaging. I'm not going to continue engaging with people who can't see what's happening around them and denying clear facts.
> in the beginning of Obama's administration Democrats controlled both the senate and the House, as well as the presidency. Was it Trump that prevented them from fixing the immigration system?
Ah yes, the democrats had four years of control of the government since Obama was elected, they didn't completely solve immigration, therefore they're at fault for sending people to CECOT without due process. Makes total rational sense.
I do blame most of the Democrats for not adequately solving things and running campaigns they seem like they're trying to lose (Beto telling Texans he's going to take away their guns, wtf?), but acting like they're doing the same things is denying reality. It's probably true most of both sides don't really want to fix the problem, but one is building prison camps and sending people to places like CECOT and one is making deferred actions. Quite different wouldn't you say?
The Republicans have been in charge of Congress for most of the last 20+ years. Why haven't they passed meaningful immigration reform? It's not like Biden and Obama vetoed that many immigration bills.
Once again, reconnect with reality again before you reply. Learn what the Trump administration is actually doing before you both-sidesing it more.
> Must be outside of your context window. You were clearly drawing in the idea this backlog of cases and immigration state we're in is the result largely from Biden's term. I see no other real reason to include such a statement. It's been true for decades.
Sure. However, areas I am interested in, become significantly worse the past 3-4 years, e.g., EB2-NIW, and similar categories. I have no idea why you think I mentioned it as a "Biden's fault" comment. But, whatever lol
> Not what I'm suggesting in the slightest.
Then why are you arguing that anyone on a valid visa but engaging in unauthorized work becomes an illegal immigrant?
> Denying obvious facts. Incredible.
Where?
> Once again, reconnect with reality again before you reply.
I am.
> Learn what the Trump administration is actually doing before you both-sidesing it more.
I am not interested, tbh. I have a life. Our convo began with me asking you for an example of a documented-> undocumented->documented transition, and you failed to provide it. Instead, you tried to argue that someone who is on a valid status but engages in unauthorized employment is illegal immigrant, which I disputed. Then, you backtracked, and went on a tangent about Biden, Trump, camps, etc.
> The others is to send people to CECOT and other prison camps with no due process (even those with legal status) and ignore the courts.
> I am sorry, but I do not plan to engage in emotions and hypothetical
> Learn what the Trump administration is actually doing before you both-sidesing it more.
>I am not interested
So just willfully ignorant. Strange how you seem to be so well versed on the topic but choose to bury your head in the sand on anything current.
> Then, you backtracked
I have not changed my stance on anything I've claimed in this entire thread.
> someone who is on a valid status but engages in unauthorized employment is illegal immigrant
I mean, they are. They're overstaying their work visa and are fraudulently applying and staying under a different visa under false pretenses. What do we call people who overstay visas (continuing employment under a temporary work visa) and apply for other visas under false pretenses?
I guess I did fail to show a documented->undocumented->documented, only a legal->illegal->legal change. Sorry, my bad. They're still involved in illegal, undocumented labor. But even then, that's under the assumption they bothered applying for some other visa in the in-between time, not everyone does.
They're extremely intertwined and often practically the same thing. They become an "illegal migrant" for continuing to work to pay for groceries and rent while not having a lawful status allowing such activity. A deportable offense, correct?
> Their workloads increased significantly over the past 3-4 years due to various factors, unfortunately.
Good job showing your true colors. Issues like this have existed for decades. I know of people that struggled in this exact scenario in the 90s and 2000s, and I was only a child at the time. Maybe we should have passed that bipartisan immigration bill the orange man said no to which would have actually funded processing the workload. In the end though this administration doesn't want these people, they want to send them to prison camps. You can tell by watching what they do, raiding people showing up to their court proceedings, sending them to hellhole detention facilities without any due process, and ignoring court decisions.