I would agree that seg faults are not fun to debug, but if you think you can be speed up production and get the product done several orders of magnitude faster without ownership rules AND you can't use a GC, I do think it could be worth the trade-off.
> Why do you think it's especially aimed at Zig?
I honestly don't use zig so I really don't have a horse in the race, but when I read:
"nothing but Rust or Go has any merit as a replacement unless it also bring the same safety. A fully unsafe language in 2022 is dumb"
That seems to be targeted at replacing C++, which both Carbon and CppFront are not doing per se. Zig is the next big "low level replacement language" (that isn't Rust or Go) that HN seems to chat about so I took a guess.
Again, I don't think that's too relevant to my point (although I am curious if OP wants to weigh in on what they meant).
> but if you think you can be speed up production and get the product done several orders of magnitude faster without ownership rules
If you genuinely believe that Rusts rules slow developers down by “several ordrers of magnitude” (which litterally means: “makes you 100 times slower or more”) then you've probably listened/read way to much anti-rust discourse for your own good…
Rust has a learning curve and in the beginning you're obviously going to be slowed down by the learning process, but for 99% of the tasks[1] once you've gone past the initial learning period, the rules aren't slowing you down since you've internalized them, and compiler errors end up being mostly about things that would have caused a memory bug in other low-level languages.
[1]: that is, everything but custom graph data structures, which are really hard to get right without a GC anyway.
I actually have started learning rust and I do like it. I am hoping to get to a point where the ownership structure becomes obvious in my mind.
If I had to make a game right now though, I would be way faster in C++.
That said though, I do hope as I learn rust everything becomes obvious. I would be very happy if I get equally as productive (since that means I can use rust for everything).
I guess I just worry that certain things are like custom graph data structures, where suddenly ownership is a huge issue.
> If I had to make a game right now though, I would be way faster in C++.
I've no doubt about that, learning Rust sometimes feels like having to swim with your hands tied in the back.
> That said though, I do hope as I learn rust everything becomes obvious. I would be very happy if I get equally as productive (since that means I can use rust for everything).
Good luck:), don't be afraid to stop and try again a few weeks later if you get too frustrated: I struggled a bit to learn rust early 2016 and after a few weeks of night hacking, I had no more free time to carry on and I was still very confused about all of that. Then, I stopped for almost 6 months, having read of few blog posts in Reddit in the meantime but nothing especially eye opening or anything, and when I got back to Rust for some reason everything sounded clear and I completed my first project in Rust very smoothly, as if my brain had been slowly digesting the concepts in a background thread during that time.
> I guess I just worry that certain things are like custom graph data structures, where suddenly ownership is a huge issue.
Advice: avoid them as much as possible (most of my former use of graph-like structures where in fact related to programming patterns and not strictly necessary for what I wanted to do) and if you're really manipulating graphs, you should probably use a dedicated library (I think petgraph is the most popular but these kind of things can be workload dependent so you might need to go for another one).
> Why do you think it's especially aimed at Zig?
I honestly don't use zig so I really don't have a horse in the race, but when I read: "nothing but Rust or Go has any merit as a replacement unless it also bring the same safety. A fully unsafe language in 2022 is dumb"
That seems to be targeted at replacing C++, which both Carbon and CppFront are not doing per se. Zig is the next big "low level replacement language" (that isn't Rust or Go) that HN seems to chat about so I took a guess.
Again, I don't think that's too relevant to my point (although I am curious if OP wants to weigh in on what they meant).