Girls and women are marginalised in the area of technology. This site in particular has hosted terabytes of discussion of this problem. If you look back at some of the stories about conferences and why codes of conduct have been set up, you will see at least part of the publicly visible part of this.
This is why it’s perfectly socially acceptable to set up a specific group to give women and girls a chance to learn skills in an environment where they feel safe from sneering, lewd comments, and other such behaviour which is not conducive to learning, or simply having a good time.
The article under discussion here is important, because boys and men face a great many difficulties in life, but the Venn diagram of difficulties faced by men and women has problems unique to each and problems shared by both.
Complaining about people getting help in areas where they face a disproportionate struggle just seems unkind.
I believe what's rubbing many the wrong way is the obvious bias towards 'girls'. The name of the programs, the focus of resources based on being VAR rather than a need someone could be (E.G. how I similarly take mild offense at programs that happen to target 'RACE' rather than 'the POOR' (anyone impoverished, even if that happens to strongly correlate to various races in sadly common cases due to past discrimination)).
So, hypothetically, what do you and others believe needs to change? How would a 'girls can code/tech/etc' look if it couldn't //market// towards girls or any other focus of discrimination? Other than perhaps types of being in the 'have nots' category which any body-type could qualify for?
> This is why it’s perfectly socially acceptable to set up a specific group to give women and girls a chance to learn skills in an environment where they feel safe from sneering, lewd comments, and other such behaviour which is not conducive to learning, or simply having a good time.
No. You just make it clear this is an environment where such behaviors are not tolerated.
Also, it's not true that women and girls are incapable of sneering and lewd comments.
You come across very much as the kind of person who believes boys are inherently deficient and deserve to fail, based on your assumptions about how boys will behave, and that they are incapable of behaving differently.
I think the culture that allows for the sexist torment that you see in conferences, in games, etc is disgusting and cannot be tolerated.
That’s a leadership and culture failure. When a female employee or student is marginalized or harassed, that’s an issue that needs to be dealt with unequivocally and swiftly.
In the school scenario I’m familiar with, my son is in 5th grade. There isn’t a gamergate environment there. We should be exposing kids to technology and coding, period. School clubs should be building that culture where the idea of bullying girls is both unacceptable and repugnant.
What does discussion on HN have to do with programs in schools? Really-- the tech industry may have issues but they are separate from how we raise and educate children, and the messaging we send those kids
Women marginalized in technology was mostly bullshit abuse of statistics. It is just being assumed that fewer women has to be the result of discrimination. It is not.
> Complaining about people getting help in areas where they face a disproportionate struggle just seems unkind.
Women don't face a disproportionate struggle in tech. They are given more opportunities in tech than men are. There are uncountable scholarships, fellowships, hiring initiatives, mentoring initiatives, and all kinds of programs for women in tech - while there are none for men. There are many positions that are explicitly advertised as for women or for underrepresented minorities only. Companies and universities give preference to hiring and admitting women, even overtly. And finally, multiple studies showed that women are given preference in hiring for STEM positions.
The first step to help men is for us to admit that men are discriminated against, and it is very counterproductive when people pretend that is not the case.
This is why it’s perfectly socially acceptable to set up a specific group to give women and girls a chance to learn skills in an environment where they feel safe from sneering, lewd comments, and other such behaviour which is not conducive to learning, or simply having a good time.
The article under discussion here is important, because boys and men face a great many difficulties in life, but the Venn diagram of difficulties faced by men and women has problems unique to each and problems shared by both.
Complaining about people getting help in areas where they face a disproportionate struggle just seems unkind.