> Prior to that, Ouchi said, his client felt compelled to take the pills because he feared that disobeying Wang would have a detrimental effect on his pending criminal case.
Makes you wonder what all kind of shady medical shit is done in jails and prisons.
> Makes you wonder what all kind of shady medical shit is done in jails and prisons.
I've personally watched guards ignore diabetic patients in crisis, and heard them tell arrested, but not yet convicted, people to not declare any medical condition that they need medications for while in custody, because the cops didn't want to drive the arrested persons to the hospital and keep them under observation while they're prescribed the medication they need.
If you don't declare any medical conditions during the intake process, and then you have a medical crisis while in custody because you don't have the medication you need to manage your condition, they aren't liable, and good luck convincing the cops to take you to a doctor.
I've heard from case workers that the medical staff in prisons delight in purposely not treating, under-treating, or mistreating prisoners' medical conditions. They just throw anti-psychotics at people because those medications keep the prisoners sedated and compliant, despite the fact that APs have serious side-effects that can be permanent and disabling.
I friend and neighbour of mine, on completing their nurses training, went to work at the local prison.
The medical care they dispensed there was far above what the prisoners received out side. And we have a good general medical system.
The guards may well have been sadistic when away from medical personnel, I cannot say.
There are all sorts of problems of all sorts of different sorts - and if it bleeds it leads - but given that I despair at the reports I keep getting from the USA. ARe things realy getting that bad?
It's always been this bad, it's just that people who weren't given a voice now have some new means to be heard and are actually being listened to instead of having their experiences discounted and discarded.
So the point is that youth protection scandals involving experimenting with medication on unwilling children are rare anywhere ? (even with the youth protection officials getting paid for it)
Ok let's check. Did youth protection do medical experiments on unwilling patients (and by that we mean that BOTH the child and the parent were not asked for permission, and very often not informed at all):
US: aside from this incident, there have been many others [3], including youth protection services specifically [5]
Netherlands: yep (and the officials got paid by Janssens Pharmaceutica) [1]
Belgium: yes [2]
Germany/Austria: jawohl [4]
And if you consider untried psychological treatments as medical experiments as well, and they can certainly have extreme negative consequence, then we should perhaps just say that every kid in youth protection gets experimented on, as this is very close to the truth.
If you think this is the worst they did, you should not Google "aversion therapy LGBTQ youth protection". That was a psychological "treatment" for not being straight that included torture, on purpose. Note that they still treat unwilling children for not being straight. Google "Gender identity disorder treatments" for example. What any sane person would call torture is still being used (ABA, for example).
And let's not forget what ritalin, official treatment for a whole range of (often misdiagnosed) conditions given to children. It is often compared to cocaine, for good reason.
Nobody can be trusted with power over other people's children. Certainly not psychiatrists, who have a LONG history of abuse centuries old, with essentially constant scandals continuing even today.
I apologize. Would it have been better if I had added that I am an American who lives in America? I don't see a comment delete option. Would you delete it for me, please?
If you post nationalistic flamebait like this, or other flamebait this egregious, to HN again, we will ban you.
Also, please don't routinely create accounts. This is also in the site guidelines. You needn't use your real name, of course, but for HN to be a community, users need some identity for other users to relate to. Otherwise we may as well have no usernames and no community, and that would be a different kind of forum. https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme...
None of this very new, but a lot of the reporting is. America locks up an astounding number of people; at any given point about half a percent of the US population is in jail, with a total of ~2.8% of the adult population being somewhere in the correctional system pipeline.
One simply cannot build a prison system capable of processing a percent of your population without the ability to either whole heartedly endorse, or at least ignore some pretty shocking abuses. A society that cared more about the rights and dignity of prisoners would not build such a system in the first place.
For comparison Canada currently imprisons 139 people per 100,000 residents, America currently imprisons 655. Germany is at 71, France is an 97, the Netherlands is at 63. America is literally incarcerating people at 4.7x the rate of its northern neighbor, and at 9-10X the rate for similarly rich EU countries.
But as a mildly funny anecdote to break the seriousness; Liechtenstein's prisoner stats have a funny detail -- Total prison population: 12.
> that I despair at the reports I keep getting from the USA. ARe things realy getting that bad?
The US press is pretty good at finding the bad reports. So count them - then count the population, and realize that, while even 1 case is too many, as a percentage, this kind of horrible stuff is very rare.
Indeed. There was a pediatric cardiac surgeon in Winnipeg whose incompetence lead to the deaths of 12 children.[1] It got to the point that other physicians wouldn't even admit cardiac patients to keep them away from this doctor. Massive failures at every point in the system. Last I heard he's working at UCLA now.
There are bad actors everywhere. We don't condemn the Canadian healthcare system because of people like this guy.
I googled the name of the malpracticing surgeon, and found a LinkedIn profile for a surgeon who works at UCLA has the same name as the surgeon in Winnipeg, but the other details don't match. I think these are two different people.
I have seen a cop order a medic to give sedative to a human that was being choked by said cops for more than 10 minutes (he was basically already dead when they injected him). Search for Tony Timpa on Youtube if you want to see the video. And they were joking while killing him. And last but not least, they all kept their jobs. All humans can be bastards.
> And last but not least, they all kept their jobs
Police unions are some of the most powerful organizations. Not being able to fire bad actors is one of the worst parts of unions. I've never understood why there hasn't been a movement to reform them. Their coworkers get stuck with them too and bringing the whole unit down.
Instead we're always sold some nostalgic narrative of past golden eras of unions. Glossing over all the warts and cruft built up over time. We're long overdue for modernized unions.
It is more that their definition of bad actor is different. Cops that break rank and complain and testify are fired or demoted. Cops that do that stuff are promoted.
Even the nostalgic narrative of the past golden era of unions is, from what I've seen, mostly a creation of propaganda.
The gains unions won for their members were worse than zero-sum, because they merely redistributed from profit (shareholder income) to worker income, while resulting in collective bargaining agreements that reduced the flexibility of the labor market.
The violence they were involved in was almost universally started by them, as illegal action that violated the employer's right to their property, and replacement worker's right to work at their site, was their main source of leverage.
Makes you wonder what all kind of shady medical shit is done in jails and prisons.