> On the other hand the one lisp guy produced cool working programs you are not able to understand,
It's this precise attitude that turns me off Lisp. First, it's not actually that hard to understand. Sure, it's harder than most other languages, but if you've done programming in half a dozen languages (some functional, etc.) Lisp holds no real mysteries.
More importantly, being hard to understand is a bad thing. A large part of what makes a good programmer is the ability to write clear, robust, easy to understand code. Yet Lisp advocates seem to love to talk up how hard the language is to learn and how subtle and mysterious it is. I'm sure that appeals to teenage boys, but it is objectively a bad thing! Like, literally - hard to understand code has all sorts of obvious disadvantages, and no compensating advantages over easy to understand code. It's a bad thing!
I've never heard any Lisp advocate talk about it being hard to learn or use (let alone in some bragging terms). The most memorable advocacy quote for me is "cuts through hard problems like a hot knife through butter".
When the language is easy to work, you delve into harder problems.
It's this precise attitude that turns me off Lisp. First, it's not actually that hard to understand. Sure, it's harder than most other languages, but if you've done programming in half a dozen languages (some functional, etc.) Lisp holds no real mysteries.
More importantly, being hard to understand is a bad thing. A large part of what makes a good programmer is the ability to write clear, robust, easy to understand code. Yet Lisp advocates seem to love to talk up how hard the language is to learn and how subtle and mysterious it is. I'm sure that appeals to teenage boys, but it is objectively a bad thing! Like, literally - hard to understand code has all sorts of obvious disadvantages, and no compensating advantages over easy to understand code. It's a bad thing!